2009 SSAD Election Reminder and Canidate Posting

dwalsh · Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 11:46 am Post subject:

Kirby I believe that each player in good standing should have his/her vote counted.To limit the vote to a Captain,is not the voice of the whole.3rd week of the Spring season,Captains hand out ballots and mail them in with that week's match reports.The winner is then in place by June and ready to handle the coming season.Reps-I am not sure there,no one seems to want that job.Then again,I'm not sure many people know what that job entails.
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kirby · Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:05 pm Post subject:

Im in agreement...
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Skizrock · Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:36 pm Post subject:

I agree too. The by laws are the next concentration point for the league.
We have been working on the rules recently and based on what we have at least started, i think we are on our way to making the rules and eventually the by laws more in line with things that make sense. There seems to be alot of things that have been done one way, that should change. MAny of these things seem to help insulate the top of the league from change, those day should be gone in my opinion. I feel if there are people who can do the job better they should be able to a fair and legitimate way to get there.
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TMOC · Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 1:10 pm Post subject:

Well said Adam.
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ScottC · Dart Sergeant Joined: Nov 20, 2007 Posts: 151

I will start by saying my intnetion is to be part of a CIVIC debate. I will play the devils advocate for a second. I am speaking for my team, but I am 100% there are many like mine.
I agree that the captains vote probably shouldn't be reflective of a 9 man roster given that 8 guys may want one AD and the captain might want the other and the captain wins.
But, on the other hand, I have a roster with 9 guys, and pretty much always have. The AD/BOD jobs/functions may be thankless, but being a captain can be stressful/aggravating as well. If I didn't go to my bar and secure a fee of $150 and a team to be sponsored, that would be one less team and I know for a fact that 7 of my players including myself, would not be in the MMDL. There are approx 430 teams in the MMDL, I would venture a GUESS and say that 1/3 to 1/2 of the teams would be in the same boat. My guys love to play, but if I didn't do the legwork:
1) Securing the sponsor/fee
2) Putting together a roster
3) Going to the captains meetings
4) Filling out rosters, especially where we are all friends and having to make the tough decision as far a roster, which certainly always alienates someone, I know teams that have broken up because of roster issues
5) Etc

"My guys love to play, but if I didn't do the legwork:" they wouldn't play. So with that being said I do think the captains have the right to be the vote for the entire team. I know plenty of people who refuse to fill out rosters or be captains because they dont want to deal with that stuff.
It just seems that there is a general bashing of "captains" here and i dont think that is right. I am not opposing all have a vote, I just beleive that if the vote remains the way it is, then it is not necessarily wrong for the captain to be the spokeperson for their team. Isn't that why people play with/for the team?
I have no issues with change, and i will roll with the punches complaint free, but in the end, if someone gets elected that I, as a captain, don't agree with, then there is a chance that I wouldn't come back, so yeah, my vote should count more. Isn't this exactly what everyone does when they quit, retire, boycott, etc? (That is in no way a knock against anyone in particular) It is jsut people demonstrating their right to play or not under the regime/rules/formats set forth.
Regarding this election, i know Chris very well, and think he would be capable, on the other hand, I dont know Scott, but i hear great things. Whoever gets in "office" down here will be great. And Suzy has been great as well.
Just one captains long-winded rant.

AmericanBadAss · Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:41 pm Post subject:

I think what ScottC has stated is how every captain should approach the job (because IMO that is what it is).

I have played for captains who do all this and more, act in the team's best interest at all times, always ask the team for their opinions before making team decisions on such things as rule issues, etc.

I have also played for captains who do none of these things other than the bare minimum. Basically they went to the meetings to turn in the roster, got the check, write the roster, and sign it post-match. Don't get me wrong that's still something but not nearly what ScottC mentions. Captains like this also do what they want for themselves or may ask 1 or 2 other opinions and the rest of the team does not get a say.

That said I can see both good and bad to captain-only votes. The captain is the one who should be contacting the AD (unless capt is unable to do so or other such circumstance) so that matters.

Think about this too: Some captains don't even show up to both meetings or if so just run in, grab the kit/drop off the roster, and run out.
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GT · Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 6:03 pm Post subject:

It may seem unfair to only have captains vote, but from a practical standpoint it is more efficient and is a standard method of democracy, albeit a flawed one. We all elect representatives to the federal gov't, and they don't always represent their vote in congress the way their constituents would prefer. All layered bureacracys operate this way.

But I'm not against opening the votes to others, I just don't want to have to figure out how to accomplish it properly. Too many other fish in the fryer.
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Bucky · Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 5:18 am Post subject:

This is a tough one.
It would be nice to have all players vote, but at the same time, how many players have actually met Scott and Chris or know anything about them.
We on SEWA and the MMDL sites are fortunate enough to somewhat know both candidates views and credentials through the forums.
But on the other side of the coin, the Captains are the ones who have to communicate with the AD's regarding ALL issues with their teams.
In my opinion the Captains are doing all the work like ScottyC said, and ultimately have all the communication with the AD's.
I would have to say that I would leave the votes to the Captains.
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TMOC · Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 7:32 am Post subject:

"It's not the voting that's democracy, it's the counting"

Tom Stoppard
British dramatist & screenwriter (1937 - )
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Suzy · Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 7:14 am Post subject:

Voting is up to the captains because this person it the "go to" for the team. They deal directly with the ADs on all questions and issues. Captains need to vote for a candidate that they know will address their issues in a timely manner and solve any disputes. When solving these disputes and AD must be impartial and make decisions based only on our By Laws and Rules & Regulations. If there is a gray area surrounding the circumstances of the issue, then the BOD is contacted and all is discussed within the BOD. A new feature of our BOD is the Commissioner's position. This has taken a lot off the shoulders of the AD, but the AD is still very much involved.
What I think is supposed to happen is 9 guys get together. They vote on their Captain. (position explained earlier in this post). Then the captain comes to the meetings and represents the team. This process has morphed into what we have today. On person, claims captains position, gets the team together and deals with the position. If we waited for teams to get together to pick a captain, no one would be ready for the first capts. meeting. The better part of doing this, though, would be ALL information on the Rosters would be complete because each player is there to make sure their information is listed and correct. (yeah this might happen).
So, in a perfect world, all the captains, were chosen by their teammates, come to the first capts. meeting and vote for their candidate based on who will be able to fulfill the needs of their team and their entire Area as well as our entire league.
Looking forward to the Fall.
Suzanne Flannery
South Shore Area Director
Minuteman Dart League
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Dartsogold · Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:20 pm Post subject:

Hi all, I will post my experience I have. I have experience with computers and software. I know excel, power point, and microsoft word, I use them regularly at work and I have that software installed at home. With excel I have created spreadsheets this season as Suzannes Assistant AD to help record division scores, they will even record your weekly average if you have a bye week. With powerpoint flyers can be created for MMDL events. I am married and have 3 teeanage daughters all of them support me and have been great in helping me out this season by taking calls and tracking stats helping me run the C, D and E playoffs for the South Shore. Having shot in the MMDL for many years, I know the rules and by laws which will assist me in making diplomatic solutions to issues that may arise during the season. I am a good listener, and will always hear all the facts before making any rulings or decisions on how to handle items of concern brought to my attention.
I am looking for all SS captians to come to the meeting on August 3, and support me by voting for me as your new Area Director. Help me to continue to help the SS and the MMDL grow in the right direction and reach new heights. I want to represent all of you and be your voice for the SS Area. I can be reached by e-mail at: sgargiulo_dartsogold@comcast.net
Thank You
Scott Gargiulo
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dwalsh · Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:13 pm Post subject:

Well it sounds like you meet all Suzy's requirements.She seems very concerned about a candidates ability to handle the computer.I am sure whoever gets the position,through a vote-a fair and unbiased vote-not one that is being influenced by the outgoing AD.Suzy,5th graders can run those programs,so even a Caveman can do it!!! Personally I want someone who is in tune with the dart players not someone who can run a computer program.I am sure Scott is qualified and makes a good candidate,but Chris Ryan should not be pushed aside just because the OUTGOING AD has ahair across her a$$ about him.Captains vote the person,not whether they can handle a computer.I believe Chris Ryan works on one all day.This is reminding me of the days when Bob Cedrone manuevered Don Garnett into his role as Boston AD nad we know how that turned out.
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Suzy · Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 9:25 am Post subject:

Is there something I should know about? I am not sure I am understanding this, at least I hope not. What hair across my a$$ are you referring to? I have no problems, to my knowledge with Chris. He has been an asset to me and my position and MMDL in the past. I appreciate greatly the help he has given to myself and the league. I have never doubted the dedication to players by either of the candidates. So what gives?
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dwalsh · Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 3:56 pm Post subject:

I believe from what I have observed and from what some people have expressed to me that you seem determined to make sure Scott is the SS AD and not Chris Ryan.I think that sux.If you feel I am wrong,then talk to Chris and see what's up.Scott this is nothing personal between you and me.I have no horse in the race and feel you would probably make a fine AD.I feel Chris deserves a fair shot as well,and I do not believe he is getting one.I'll go out on a limb for all to see for Chris's right to a fair election and I stand by my statements,I do not feel Suzanne is allowing for a fair election.If Chris comes out and says I am wrong and he feels he is getting a fair shake,I will publicaly apologize.I believe I am right and I will express those feelings.
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"Alcohol is the anesthesia by which we endure the operation of life"
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Dartsogold · Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 4:37 pm Post subject:

Dave, No hard feelings, I to want a fair election. Elections are won by campaigning which includes handing out flyers and going to matches to meet captains and players. I certainly hope you are not comparing me to a Donald Garnett, I don't feel I am anything like him at all. I have been campaigning myself and feel I will represent the SS proudly and fairly and I am looking for the support of the Captains and team members on the SS, and if that includes Suzanne, I welcome her support as well. Chris feel free to correct me but just for the record I have helped Chris by making playoff brackets for the SSDA and I sent him my template of my flyer so he could make one of his own.
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Chitown599 · Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 4:19 am Post subject:

I have to jump in on this. While I have nothing but respect for both Suzy, and Scott, I also feel that Scott has all but been ordained as the next S.S. AD. He has been working side by side with Suzy, for a while now, maybe of his own accord, but still doing so. This could be his way of campaigning, as well, I don't know. I do know that Scott has taken the bull by the horns, and for some reason, Chris hasn't.
I know Chris wants the job, and I feel he would be very good as the S.S. AD rep. But if he wants the job, he needs to show it. Chris, this is not a knock on you, but Dave Walsh has been quite outspoken on your behalf, and you have not once come on here to agree, or refute his posts.
If you are serious about running, you need to step up and start selling yourself, as Scott has done. We are all friends here, but you can't rely on friendship alone.

Just my opinion.
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AmericanBadAss · Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 5:10 am Post subject:

No offense taken Chi.

I have tried to do things here (such as the AD questions) and it doesn't seem to go in a productive manner, for one thing.

That said, you said it yourself..my friends are here but it's going to take captains to elect an AD..many more than post on this site. No offense to anyone here, any MMDL player is important, but I have been and will continue to campaign myself to those who can cast a vote first and foremost.

Regarding the computer skills..I have all that is needed. I'd rather not say too much more for fear of it getting twisted around somehow.
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Dartsogold · Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:04 am Post subject:

Chitown599 · Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:09 am Post subject:

dwalsh · Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 2:05 pm Post subject:

Chris if you want it go get it.You have to remind people there are two candidates for the position,because Suzanne will not.Chris you have helped Suzanne in the past as her assistant,when the league wouldn't recognize assistants.Yet she only touts Scott as her Assistant Ad.I find that wrong.That is what I mean when I say this election is not on a level playing field.People can jump on me all they want,but what's right is right.
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AmericanBadAss · Posted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 2:33 pm Post subject:

Well said Dave. No doubt in my mind that anyone who posts here knows I am in the running as well.

Recently it was said to me by someone else that I need to remember that while yes there are people on here who will have a vote, there are a lot of others who aren't here that will also have a vote and I need to reach out to them as well.

Certainly my time spent here campaigning in the past was not for naught, as it is known who I am, what I will do, etc etc. The statement mentioned above caused me to also focus on doing things in addition to that recently to sell myself. It is not a slight to anyone here and I hope it is not taken this way.
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JustTheFacts · Posted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 7:21 pm Post subject:

Scott and Chris, good luck tomorrow to both of you.

Knowing both of you as I do, I am confident that no matter who prevails in the vote tomorrow, the real winner is the MMDL South Shore!
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dwalsh · Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2009 10:40 am Post subject:

As long as it is afair process we will be winners.
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